Elden Ring Lore

Well. For some reason - I can only guess - I feel compelled to write about Elden Ring and its Lore. The Catalyst has been a Reddit post I've read a few weeks ago, while ordinarily Elden Ring Lore strikes me in one of two ways: There's stuff I find interesting; And stuff that gives me a bit of a headache. Especially on Reddit, I feel like whenever there's a Lore related topic, there will be at least ten people that go like "uhm actually" followed by a totally different take on the matter. And each of those 'opinions' will be followed by like ten responses saying why they're wrong.

For some reason then, that post I've read, made me go like: Hmm ... wait a sec!

It's not that I know enough about Elden Ring Lore, or so the depths of the Rabbit Hole; Like, it would seem that if you can put a compelling theory together, I might be inclined to believe it - because I don't know how to debunk it. Like, there was a video making the case that Melina is Miquella. And I was like [Bgshoom - Mind Blown] - not to suppose that I had a lot of mind on the matter that could be blown. And I suppose, this aspect might be the interesting part here, but how to make it matter is a bit beyond me right now.


I do however know, or understand, a FEW things about Elden Ring Lord. After all the many videos I've watched on the matter, I should understand a little bit. But like watching a few PBS Spacetime videos isn't going to make me an Astrophysicist, my understanding of Elden Ring Lore doesn't extent far beyond having an appreciation for the Level of Depth that went into the design of this game.

I mean, from 'the Tarnished Archaeologist' I suppose, I took it that the whole matter with the two and the three fingers, is taken from a historic event, whereby Christians were literally at each other's throats over the amount of fingers to draw the crucifix with. A schism that emerged over something so utterly trivial it's ridiculous.
It then might seem like a stretch to look at various assets in the world, like paintings, reliefs or architecture; And pretend like it's all 'real'. But if there's Lore - and by virtue of that different cultures - it's not that wild to assume that the designers took care to reflect that within the decisions that were made. And Lore there is, and different cultures there are.

Most, uh, "prominently": There's "the Crucible"; As one of the things that stands apart from "Queen Marika and the Golden Order". ... And somehow everyone has a reason to kill you, which is weird.


So, from my first impression of the Lore, the first thing is that we - as the players - are special because we can still see the guiding grace. That would elude to there being some higher will, guiding us to "become Elden Lord". Whatever that may be. And it turns out, there were at least two before us. So, at first glance that would be the typical "Miyazaki's games don't actually have endings" thing, where we're just another Character completing a cycle. But something didn't sit with me about it. That thing being, that the two Lords that came before us, they ... have a lot more going for them - Lore wise - than just: Go to tree and beat the Boss. Godfrey was like ... first husband to Marika? And Placidusax was, just as Godfrey, Lord of what would appear to be a different Goddess. The one before Marika ascended. So, given that we are to compare ourselves to them, it seems like ... we don't have the first clue about what the heck is going on, what the fuck we are supposed to or attempting to do; And I suppose everyone keeps on telling us as much as we progress through the game.

And yea, as a few have pointed out: We're also Maidenless. And it's not like we do have any in-game understanding of what that even means. I mean, the people familiar with the Lore might; And those that would appear to still have one don't seem to know it any better either. As it stands, in the Lands Between, Maidens would seem to mostly just be baggage, relics, of some long-gone religion; Which is why they tend to get gotten rid of.


But alas, having nothing better to do we more or less follow the guiding grace ... acquiring Great Runes ... and with a little bit of Luck or Cheating we learn that ... Marika is Radagon. And I'm like: Who the fuck is Radagon?
It's one of those things that ... I'm not sure whether or not the Elden Ring Academia has come to a consensus on the matter; But the two dominant theories would be that: Either Marika and Radagon were two separate entities that became one - for some reason; Or Marika and Radagon were literally the same from the onset. I'm inclided to believe the former, however: Ranni is a daughter of Rennala and Radagon, not in fact a Daughter of Marika - so, how can she be an Empyrian? What even is an Empyrian?

It cannot be excluded that there are some Plotholes in the story. So, in the end, the Lore is what it is; And to be that, it doesn't have to make perfect sense. Which is something we might have to keep in mind, but it's not like we can really ... work with that knowledge. So, anyhow ...


At the end then, "of the Story", or a wild egg-hunt by curious minds - the story reads as: Marika fucked up. At the very least. Things didn't go as intended. But ... whatever's up with that, isn't really our concern right now. The thing though is: Marika did 'something' - and that 'something' ... had consequences upon consequences. We wouldn't even notice - unless we're to make something of the impression that the Lands Between do seem rather deserted. The story goes however, that there was an age of plenty, but it swiftly came to an end. Hence the world is captured in Ruin - and everything is several degrees of fucked. I mean: It's a Videogame - so there's a degree of Abstraction, I think, between what the world is meant to be like Lore-wise; And what it is presented as through the gameplay. But it is implied by Lore, that the Erd-Tree once had a function that it can no-longer serve - and that it has since become more an object of Faith.
Even Melina - she who seems to be the only one left that has a little bit of a clue of what's going on - seems to have none, actually. Same goes for Morgott. He's playing all high and mighty, but once we're done with him we can talk to his body laying on the floor and he'll give us a speech of how fucked everything is.

And I suppose it cannot be overstated just HOW ... Capital FCKD shit is. I mean, the one "political Body" that comes close to being in working order ... has a Giant "God-eating" snake in its basement. But that also touches on one theme that I want to be focusing on: The thing with 'the Outer Gods'.


The 'Outer Gods' are entities that don't seem to belong into the lands Between. There's "the Rot", there's whatever came upon Rykard, then there's the "Formless Mother" as whatever Mogh is aligned with, then there's the Frenzied Flame as associated with the three Fingers; And by some accounts there's also "the Greater Will" as embodied by the Elden Beast.
And it would seem to me, that these aren't so much 'stranger' to the Lands Between; But more-so might they be natural entities within the World, that exist in some "normal" Darwinian Rivalry. The Greater Will merely won enough to be the one manifested at the heart of the world.
And by some interpretation could the Frenzied Flame be one of the good forces. Well, its followers - some at least - would see it that way; With my idea being, that the "frenzied" part is merely a kind of 'upsetness' over what has taken root - without any kind of rationality to see the world as anything but flammable.

Now, I don't know if "we know" what's up with or between the two and the three fingers - whether they were one perhaps or not - nor what locked the three fingers in that chamber. We do know however, that there are only two powers that could burn the Erd-Tree: Melina as the Kindling Maiden - and we once carrying the Frenzied Flame. Apart from that are the Two fingers not quite as ... 'cool', for the lack of a better term, as we're led on to believe. I mean: They're quite happy to send us onto our Journey to become Elden Lord; But once we defeat Morgott and have stood before the locked entrance to the inside of the tree ... they all of a sudden become quiet. And that goes with Gideon's sentiment, that we're not actually meant to become Elden Lord. That the whole "Become Elden Lord" thing was just a hoax made up to ... distract us from what's actually going on. Or to maintain the facade that things are ... "fine".


But so ... burning the Erd-Tree. "The Fallen Leaves tell a Story".
I find it fascinating. I mean, talking about Elden Ring Lore is like ... by 'big picture' Real World standards ... we might say an utterly debaucherous luxury. While I here write about Elden Ring, shit's going on in the world that I'm quite happy to not be a part of. And I don't know why I'm not more concerned about all that. It's not that I don't care. It's just ... I've done my fair share of caring to be like ... sick of the political carousel. And whether I care about Elden Ring Lore or something else, doesn't seem to make much of a difference; But in my own mental well-being.
Well ... . We might say that it's all just a huge deception in the end. That it's all part of the same ... capitalistic hellscape. That YouTubers that focus on Elden Ring Lore don't do so for any reason other than that it's content people might watch. But I'd say, that that's a very "Frenzied Flame"-esque way of looking at it.

I mean - as I understand, 'the Tarnished Archaeologist' played the game, was fascinated by the detail of the world and then chose to make a video about it. And I resonate with that narrative. That life, is life. It happens. And where ever it takes us, is where we're taken. And just as Melina implores us to not take the path of the Frenzied Flame, I'd say that there's good in all the bad that's surrounding us.
And me writing this - I think is first and foremost ... to commemorate that. Like ... currently in Street Fighter Six. Playing in the Battle-hub to then "Group Hadoken points at Giant Akuma" (trust me, it makes sense) ... it's utterly silly but ... it's fun. Fun by virtue of being part of a community. Fun by virtue of having some culture. Fun by virtue of extraordinary events that allow us to celebrate. Even if it's ... just silly. And so, it being silly means that there isn't a lot of ... justification. Other than one grounded in the belief that being silly sometimes ... is a good thing. Anyhow ... on with the text.
"The Fallen Leaves tell a Story".


So, the Burning of the Erd-Tree, by what we get from how the game presents it, is perceived as this great Cataclysm. Something ... utterly unfathomable. So much so that, that's how some people - myself included - read it, some people just spontaneously die of a heart-attack or something upon seeing it. R.I.P. Brother Corhyn.
There are a few groups that take issue with the Tree. Volcano Mannor is like a sworn enemy of "the Tree", some Groups seem to flock around the idea of burning the thing, which is perceived as some kind of 'cardinal sin'. And at long last: The fact that Melina's sole purpose is to burn the thing, is at least a little bit peculiar.

And there's more I suppose. Enough so, that I think it's agreed upon, that the burning of the Tree had a central role once, in the Lands Between; A practice that had been removed by Queen Marika. Here and there we may learn, that one of the things Marika did, was to remove 'Death' from the Elden Ring. Or "Destined Death" - I suppose - as it's called. And as this pops up in a lot of places, in different ways, it's I think generally agreed upon that that fucked things up significantly.
So - things can no longer really die, undead roam the lands, burial rites became useless - and whatever purpose they served can no longer be accomplished; And so it stands to reason, that the absence of death caused things to turn ... "lifeless" in a sense.

Several people have explained it in different ways; I think we can also see an analogy to late-stage Capitalism in there. Late-stage capitalism is all about endless growth. And as the vaults of the rich keep getting filled, the stuff they get filled with is like sucked from the world around. While what grows there might seem like an immortal, shining tree of magnificent gold; Eventually it grows stagnant - as eventually there's nothing left to draw from.
"And the sap from the Tree stops flowing".
Now, the first beat I hereby come to take from that Reddit Post, is the idea that the 'Rot' isn't as much a power of Decay, but one of uncontrolled or excess vitality. So, Cancer - in a sense. People on Reddit heavily disagreed with that take - and I can see why. But if we argue that the stagnation in the Lands Between is because the Tree sucks up all the life - the Rot might merely be a consequence of "Vitality devoid of Life". But ... that's neither here nor there.


I mean - I do want to ... stay clear of speculation. Especially as I'm sure that there are some points we, as the consumer, can be puzzled over, that don't have an explicit in-Lore explanation. So we're dealing with what or how the Authors may have felt - such that we're dealing with concepts in the abstract that may be based on some deeper idea; But if that idea isn't fleshed out, it may prove to be inconsistent.


Anyhow - so far I've only like ... tried to point out the obvious. For the most part. These are like, minus a thing or two, definitive facts of the story. Or, the situation.
Now, that Reddit Post I've read claimed, that their one single theory solves everything. And essentially it argues, that the Burning of the Tree was something that had to be done ever so often. That it was the purpose of the Kindling Maiden to be the Kindling; And the purpose of the Elden Lord and their Maiden to steward over the aftermath. Give or take.
So were Marika and Godfrey the next in line - possibly by winning in some Competition or Battle - but that Marika had other ideas of where to take things. Well, the theory implied that the Maiden - in this case Marika - was to also be the Kindling by the time that era came to an end; And that she wouldn't have it.

And ... apparently there are some things wrong with that theory. And yet do some things strike me as ... self-evident.


Anyway. By now - with the Story Trailer out - we know a little bit more and all the ER-LoreTubers are all over it. My impression now is, that the thing that Marika did ... had much more gruesome consequences than ... the stories told in item descriptions could have conveyed.

The thing for once however is, that "we knew" that something along those lines "happened". Which is to say that Marika triggered some kind of inquisition that would get rid of evidence from the foregone era, such that she could establish her own reign as "the Eternal". The webbing of motivations and factors playing into that may be more complex; And at times tell a different story; But at the core of it, that's part of the story told by the fallen leaves.

And as of that we understand, that in this foregone era, "the Crucible" - also called: "The Primordial Form of the Erd-Tree", however that makes sense - was the center of precessions. We might describe it as: What was replaced by the Golden Order. However ... there's something weird going on.
Like, if we assume that "the Crucible" was "the way of things" prior to Marika ... fucking things over ... we'd assume that after she was done with it, the Crucible was ... no more. However, we learn that the Crucible Knights for instance are associated with Godfrey. Even so during a time, where "the Crucible" appears to be like ... in line with the Golden Order.
... hmm. I might remember incorrectly. However ... . I mean ... for once I learned that there's what's called "Aspects of the the Crucible". That would be Tails, Wings and Horns. Things that were once cherished as divine; But are shunned as ... "unnatural" or ... 'Blasphemous' by the Golden Order. And the Crucible Knights ... they exist - to my understanding - in some weird limbo between those two sides.

It's not entirely clear to me. Mostly, perhaps, because the themes kind of blur together. The big theme here is 'the transition'. Some items are specific about a change in perception that occurred. How the aspects of the Crucible eventually became ... subject to ridicule or ... perhaps scorn even.
And I can't help but think that Morgott and Mogh have something to do with it. That Marika was so distrought over the disfigurement of her children ... that she went like ... scorched earth against the entire thing.
But as I'm out of my depth here - I want to avoid taking it as a "mind-blown, it all comes together" kind of epiphany.


And we might also leave it at that. To say, that Marika's hubris and its consequence are what it all comes down to - whatever the details may be. Perhaps that what came before wasn't perfect - it almost certainly wasn't; And perhaps a return to it isn't really a solution either. But mistakes were made; And ... whether we can or cannot do anything to acknowledge that in-game ... isn't as important as what we might take-away for ourselves.

And yea, more than anything - I'm curious. I guess ... in a weird Morbid way, given the nature of things that are - presumably - about to be disclosed. Not that I care much about it, or would be able to understand a damn thing I run into while playing the DLC; But ... I'm curious to learn more regardless.
But still I have things on my mind - though, with that I suppose I'm venturing into the territory of speculation.


I mean - obviously the major beats of the story are set. What we're missing are some of the details. At the end of the day Marika may have been "right all along" - but due to being too stubborn to acknowledge her mistakes the journey the game sends us on still bears legitimacy. Whatever Plot-twists there might be waiting for us, they're not going to be of much consequence. At least that's how I take the statement, that the DLC will not add to the base-game in that way.

I think however, that the base-game could be seen as 'the consequences', whereas the DLC is going to delve into "the reasons". For now I like to think, that "Messmer's flame" is "the Kindling Fire", minus its kindling essence - thus the separation into the two and the three fingers.

It's a theory. I would describe it as a lens. A brainfart that somehow stuck; That then has me curious to see whether it holds any water. Thereby we can't rely on Melina to know what's up - as she seems to have forgotten certain things. What she knows is what she learned by observing the world since then. So it would seem. Naturally then, however, without the part that has been "removed from the kindling essence", the fire is ... 'frenzied'. And whatever resides within the kindling essence, thus - similar to the Rot - works without any "channels of expression". Hence it's Chaos that some people have then constructed their own philosophy around.


It is, I think, also apparent that the Erd-Tree is fueled by ... corpses. Be it blood or bodies or whatever. And that the fallout of whatever Marika did, has been about learning how to nourish the tree without ... any of the things that had been done prior. Miquella then tried to grow another Erd-Tree by using himself as the nourishment; Which apparently turned out to be another failure.
How he then however came to divest his flesh ... how that fits into the timeline ... is yet to be seen.


What's curious to me is that the Shadow Tree has sap flowing from it. Or whatever that is. And it seems to fall into some kind of ... crucible shaped thing. What's also curious to me is, that Leyndell is covered in ash; Though - from what the story seems to suggest, there was no Burning of the Tree that should or could have taken place after Marika took power. I would mark these as two peculiarities that ... don't seem to make any sense.
So, the Shadow Tree seems charred - burned even - but it produces sap. The Erd-Tree seems to have lost its vitality and no Burning has been going on, and yet Leyndell is covered in Ash.
It's likely however, that whatever flows from the Shadow Tree isn't good. If it were, things - I assume - would go different. It would also imply that Messmer were the only one that really got what they wanted; And that rather than trying to cover anything up, Marika tried to imprison him.
Which would also suggest, that Miquella's quest is more of a fool's errand - or however, as fitting for the theme, fucked around so and so many corners.

Some speculate that the Erd-Tree is only an illusion. And yet there seems to have been an age of Plenty. And how is the entrance to the Tree locked, if it doesn't actually exist?
Also it burns and produces Ash.

Now, I don't know what the scholars say about the Age of Leyndell. From what I read, the end of the age of Plenty could be linked to some Cataclysm that has since been removed from the History Books; Rather than merely some ... dwindling vitality.
It's all ... very confusing.

There is a connection, an explanation, something ... but it's either that I'm missing something, or that the truth is something we're not meant to know. ... Yet.

For so, "Fallen Leaves" take shape in three Grand Civilizations. There was the Ancient Dynasty, those were the Builders of the Aqueducts. Then there are the Eternal Cities nested between; And finally whatever's left on the surface. All in varying states of decay.
We know that a Civil War broke loose once, that siege was laid to Leyndell - and we're left to reason that this shattering took place some time after Marika had ascended.
What I find peculiar about that, is that we don't seem to know much about the conclusion to the Shattering. It would seem that eventually things calmed down - and that not because either side had won anything.
But that merely ... enough time had passed.

Why did the Night of the Black Knives happen? When did it happen? Before? After? During?
Clearly, I can't find an answer. And given that I'm now curious to learn more of what I might be missing - this is in about as much as I can fathom right now.


Perhaps what we'll find is, that not all questions need answers. Or, that the answers we need are posed by questions buried somewhere out of sight. Which is my way of dealing with my own Cluelessness - casting my curiosity for answers onto things ... that are as of yet clearly beyond our reach.

Given for instance, that we see Messmer in a state that isn't ... worn down, makes me suspicious. Uneasy.
It might just be, that the Role of Radagon ... is yet to be fully understood.
Uhm, I mean ... actually ... that's ... that definitely seems to be true.


And so, I come to a close here.
Shruggingly.
...

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This ONE theory answers EVERY MAJOR MYSTERY in Elden Ring! (Reddit Post)